SPEAKER_00 0:12

You're listening to the Philanthropists podcast with Richard Davis. And it's with Sara Lomelin. Now Sara is the uh CEO of Philanthropy Together, which is an organization based in the US which exists essentially to bring together giving circles and to try and kind of uh share knowledge and experience and build a community around the idea of collective giving. And so I sat down with Hassara quite recently uh to have a conversation all about collective giving and identity and philanthropy and the kind of intersection between those things. So we talked about what philanthropy together does and the idea of giving circles. We talked a bit about what giving circles are and who it is that forms them and what they do. So uh what kinds of people and groups form giving circles? Do they appeal more to certain groups, whether that's younger donors, uh women, or marginalized groups? And what kinds of models do they use? What sort of approaches are they are they taking? How do they make decisions when it comes to to distributing resources? Um we also talked about the relationship between identity and community and and philanthropy. So an interesting question to me, which I asked Sarah, is about whether when we're talking about collective models of giving, uh do you need to have a pre-existing shared sense of identity in order to come together and give? Or does the act of coming together and giving create that sense of community and identity, or or is it a bit of both? We also talked a bit about the role that place plays in uh giving people a sense of shared identity and and how that is still important even in an age where the internet allows us to create communities that aren't geographically based. Um we talked about the importance of learning from other cultures of giving, um, because one of the things that you quickly see when you look at the world of giving circles is that many of them do reflect much wider cultures of generosity that are linked to uh immigrant or diaspora communities, um and how we can kind of learn from this in the mainstream non-profit world and perhaps have a little bit more intellectual humility. Um we also talked about the role that collective giving could play in democratising philanthropy, whether that's uh sort of within philanthropy and making it more democratic itself, or whether it's uh playing a part in uh kind of assuaging some of the concerns about the uh the the role, the anti-democratic role that elite and big money philanthropy plays within society. Um and we also talked about whether um giving circles might allow for uh funding for more kind of radical, uh riskier in uh groups, uh social movements and grassroots organizations, precisely because the people involved in the giving circles tend to be uh part of the same communities as the people on the grounds doing the work, and whether there is a greater uh knowledge and understanding and trust and therefore uh an ability to either to take uh what seem to be bigger risks or for those risks not to seem so big in the first place. Um so without further ado, uh I'll stop giving you the summary and let uh Sara start doing the talking. Um I will be back at the end for the usual bit of housekeeping and tidying up, but in the meantime, enjoy. Okay, great. Well, I'm here with Sara Lomelin. Hi, Sarah.

SPEAKER_01 4:06

Hi, Rodri, how are you?

SPEAKER_00 4:08

I'm very well, thank you, and it's great to have a chance to talk to you on the podcast. Thanks very much for finding the time. So, um, as people will know from uh from the introduction that they've just heard, and also I'm sure from from your name, um, that you are the founding CEO of uh Philanthropy Together, amongst many other things, and I'm sure we'll talk about some of those others. So maybe the best place to start is just for you to say a little bit in your own words about what philanthropy together is as an organization, how it came about, and what the mission is.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

Uh yes, of course. So, philanthropy together is on a mission to democratize and diversify philanthropy globally in order to expand who and what gets funded. We do this through storytelling, training, research, and advocacy. And the whole idea is that we want to usher in a new era of philanthropy that is democratic, that is diverse, and it is powered by people acting in solidarity. Our goal is to scale and strengthen all models of collective giving. That's our sweet spot: giving circle, collaborative funds, fundraising circles, and so many more. And how we came to be in through, you know, collective giving model or giving circle model, we are the brainchild of more than 100 people. Um, so back in 2016, uh, the collective giving research group was doing uh a landscape research around giving circles, right? Around giving circles. And they saw that at that moment there were about 1600 giving circles in the US that had involved about 150,000 people in the last 20 years. And those 1600 given circles had to move about 1.3 billion dollars with a B. So we said, okay, this is really exciting. And guess what? There it doesn't exist any organization or a place for all of us that are, you know, working with Given Circles and involved in Given Circles to get together. So thanks to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, we um we went into a full co-design year uh that was led by a group of five women. I was one of those five. Uh, but with me, there was uh Felicia Herman and Liz Fisher from Amplifier, Marsha Morgan from the Community Investment Network, uh Paula Liang from Philanos, Hallie Lee from uh the Asian uh the Asian Women's Giving Circle. And all of us were you know um organized by the brilliant Isis Krause. And after that year, we had hundreds of hours of Zoom calls uh before Zoom was even popular, by the way. Like you we should have, you know, bought stock on Zoom because this was in 2019, in 2018 and 2019. And then um we ended up uh at a convening at the Gates Foundation with a hundred people and walls and walls full of posted notes uh because we wanted to hear everybody's you know opinions and input. And after that, we uh came back to the Gates Foundation with a plan for a five-year initiative. And that is what Philanthropy Together is. So we we launch uh on April 1st of 2020, right at the beginning of the pandemic.

SPEAKER_00 7:32

Great. And and as you say, the aim, you know, the the starting point is sort of existing uh giving circles and trying to bring those together to uh kind of make connections and and bring shared learning together between different giving circles. Because I would assume giving circles often quite reflective of the community that they've formed around, whether that's a place-based one or an identity-based one. What did you find initially about how much kind of commonality there was between your different experiences and how much of it was kind of particular to um to the particular thing that had brought you together?

SPEAKER_01 8:04

Well, you know, we have four strategic focus areas, and two of them are to bring new people into collective giving and the other two to the existing field, right? And as you said, yes, you know, a lot of giving circles, 84% of giving circles uh give locally. So uh a lot of these times you have people from the same community that are the members of the giving circle, right? They're supporting their local communities. Um, a lot of the times, you know, there's, and that's the beauty of collective giving, that uh a lot of the power dynamics get, you know, that they get blurred, right? They they you you kind of get rid of power dynamics because it's really a movement of philanthropy by the people for the people. And you know, when I talk about philanthropy, because I we know that that word is pretty charged in in in lots of places, uh, the way we you know we think about philanthropy is going back to the roots of the word, right? It's it's it's love of humanity. And that is how we understand it. It's about you know all kinds of generosity, not only with um, you know, with a financial contribution, but really, you know, thinking about the five T's, how you give your time, your talent, your testimony, your uh your treasure, which is the financial contribution, and your tithe, right? Because all of us are part of different networks, and a lot of times the doors that we can open to those organizations or initiatives that we care about are a lot more important that important than the financial contribution that we can give to them.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Yeah, absolutely. And there's loads that I want to pick up on about how uh kind of collective giving fits into some of the wider debates that that are going on about the role of philanthropy at the moment. I guess first I just wanted to ask a bit about what we know about who it is that gets involved in collective giving and what drives that. So, do you have any sense of kind of what the typical donor, if at all there is one, that gets involved in some of the giving circles you're involved with are and how they might differ from uh, you know, kind of some of the the donors that you would find elsewhere? I mean, are they are they younger? Do you tend to get a different gender balance? Uh, you know, are there any things that you found that that this model kind of particularly appeals to to particular types of donors?

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Great questions. And you know, it's funny because every time we said when you when you know one given circle, you know one given circle. Because the model, the model is extremely, extremely flexible, right? At the same time, and this is very exciting, and and I think this is the the right timing, uh, that landscape research that I told you about in 2016, we just had uh we were refreshing the whole thing, we're updating the whole landscape. So this year at the beginning of the year, we um, well, actually not we we could we commission it, but uh uh Adriana Loson Ceballo from Colmena Consulting and Michael Leyton from the Johnson Center of Philanthropy, they developed a couple of surveys that they put out to the community, right? So we have the surveys, one member survey and one um group survey that were out uh that were open for about six months. So right now they are in the moment of analyzing all that data. I don't have the official numbers yet because we're going to release that report at the beginning of next year, but it is really, it is really encouraging and hopeful for the things that you're mentioning, right? It is a more democratized and diverse field. So it's a field that, yes, uh, the majority of giving circles are led by women. 70% uh in the 2016 study, and I am guessing it's going to be a similar number this time of giving circles are led by women, but we see a lot more younger people getting involved. Um, and actually, if I if I can tell you a story that I love, is of this uh young woman, 16 years old in Arizona, and her mom was a member of a giving circle, and she wanted to do something with her friends. So she got in a mission to recruit 100 teenagers, and actually, she got 180 teenagers from different high schools, and they each of them gives $25 a quarter, so $100 a year. And they give grants to organizations that support adolescents and teenagers around mental health, uh, homelessness, and all the things that affect this particular demographic. And every time they get together, you know, they have food, they bring a DJ. So the beauty of giving circles is that literally the group can invent and set their own rules of engagement, right? In terms not only on the culture of their given circle, but also in the amount of the donation, right? Some given circles have a minimum donation. Uh, a lot of given circles kind of use this uh hundred or a thousand, right? Because it's easy, the multiplying is easy. Some given circles have a minimum amount uh to give, but not a feeling, and that is really smart because you don't want to ever leave money on the table. Some given circles have a sliding scale, right? So uh depending on how advanced are you in your career or maybe your age, there's some large women's giving circles that, for example, if women are in their 20s, uh, they will be giving, you know, a smaller amount than if they are in their 30s or they're in their 40s. Um, there's others, other giving circles that have very innovative models of giving. Like there is a circle in New York uh called Rat Fund, and that's a small circle. It's a group of you know 12, 15 friends. They are very focused on social justice in New York. And their model is that each member gives 1% of their annual income and 0.01% of their net worth. So if you think about this one, this is really based in trust, right? Because no one is asking the other person, okay, show me how much are you earning, right? And the whole idea is that it is very equitable. And for every $100,000 more that you earn, for example, if you earn $100,000, you will give 1%. But if you earn $200,000, you will need to give 2%. So, and then, you know, like that. So there, I think the sky is the limit in the way people conceptualize uh the way they give.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

Yeah, it's really, I mean, really interesting to hear. And you you mentioned um a couple of points there about the the way in which the the collect the model of collective giving potentially sort of democratizes philanthropy. And in and in part, it seems that's in terms of who is able to call themselves a philanthropist or engage on the donor side. Does it does it also extend in what you've seen to how the decisions are made about where the money is is given? What kind of models are these giving circles adopting when it comes to deciding, you know, once they've pooled their money, how to get it out again? Because I would assume that they're not suddenly becoming really autocratic and hierarchical. So they must have mechanisms that allow everyone to have a say in where the money goes. And have you seen any interesting examples of that? Totally, totally.

SPEAKER_01 15:42

And and again, you know, the there is a big spectrum of how uh given circles, you know, make their decisions, right? Some of them, uh the smaller ones, do it by consensus. And you know that sometimes you know getting to consensus is messy and it's, you know, it takes time. But if your given circle is small enough that you can get consensus, that's you know, amazing. And we I always said that you know, the second part of a given circle is this opening up uh space for discourse. Um, because even though you may have you know members uh rallying around and backing uh at the same cost, people may come from different backgrounds, from different political perspectives, different points of view. And the beauty of a given circle is that they get a space to talk to one another, to uh listen to other perspectives, to change their minds, right? Because a lot of times, you know, you come with an idea, and after hearing someone else, you change your mind, and it's okay to change your mind because your uh your perspective is getting richer by the perspectives of others, right? So some people some giving circles do consensus, larger giving circles do, you know, uh a democratic vote, so everybody votes. Um, the very large giving circles, you know, those that have hundreds of members, uh usually have different committees. So they may have like a grand committee of about 10, 15 people that are the ones that do kind of like a first pass on, okay, you know, if we have, if we're have, you know, 30 organizations that we are thinking about, we're not going to put 30 organizations in front of 200 people. Uh, what about, you know, we we decide on 10 and then we put 10 in front of the people? So some large given circles do that. On the other hand, and this is you know extremely exciting, um, and especially um after the pandemic, we are seeing a lot of solidarity circles, a lot of circles that are doing, you know, uh participatory grant making. So they are inviting voices from the community to make the decisions. Some of them as part of you know, um, vis-a-vis, then the members of the giving circles, and some of them are literally passing the decision making to the community. So you have a group of people that are basically getting together, learning together, uh, pulling the money, but the decision of where the money is going is not decided by them, but it's passed to members of the community.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

That yeah, that's really interesting because that was something I was I was going to ask was about whether you'd seen the emergence of any kind of participatory approaches. Because it because it does feel as though if particularly if you have either a place-based or an identity-based giving circle and and where you have variable levels of wealth, the the line between that and almost a kind of mutual aid or solidarity network is is quite blurry. So it's really interesting to hear that they are building that into the approaches that they're taking and trying to sort of democratize in in that way as well. Totally.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

And another thing, but sorry, before we move to the to the next, uh something else that I wanted to say uh that we have seen in the in the past few years. Also, you know, given circles uh made out of uh a specific ethnicity or group, but they are giving to another marginalized group. So for example, uh there is this given circle in California called the Lunar Project, and it's a group of Asian uh American Pacific Islanders, uh, and they are giving to Black-led uh organizations. So that is extremely, again, right, like that is where we all want to get to. I feel that, you know, especially in in the in how we in the condition of the world right now, right? What we want is getting back to uh we're humans, all of us, and we should be taking care of one another. So um I for me it's extremely exciting to see these kind of giving circles.

SPEAKER_00 19:55

Yeah, and it I mean you you said earlier about kind of returning to the the original definition of philanthropy as as love of humanity. And one of the things that I've noticed around this sort of uh discussion around collective giving is that as well as democratizing, it does seem to be giving people uh broader horizons in terms of understanding different cultures of giving from around the world, particularly where you get kind of uh identity-based communities who might be kind of immigrant communities forming forming giving circles. Um, and I know Giving Tuesday's done some really interesting work on this, and um, I saw that Hallie Lee had a you know a great article kind of about different cultures of giving relatively recently. Do you think that's one of the things that you can kind of help push as well in the work that you're doing at Philanthropy together to try and expand everybody's understanding of you know what generosity is and what philanthropy can be? And that actually there are all of these different cultures of generosity from all around the world, and we can learn from each other rather than I think just leaning on one quite narrow model of kind of you know um US-UK um uh kind of philanthropy that that I think maybe we have in the past.

SPEAKER_01 21:04

Totally, totally. And actually, you know, a big shout out to Hallie Lee because she's one of the godmothers of philanthropy together and a dear friend. And then Giving Tuesday, I have the privilege uh to serve on the board and you know, we we partner really closely because it's exactly that. And I something that I love about Giving Tuesday is this concept of radical generosity, right? And that it's so for me, you know, radical generosity is something that it's not about waking up and saying, Oh, today I'm going to be generous and I'm going to be doing this and that. It's a way of living, it's how you wake up every morning and you are generous with your smile, with your time, with um everything that you offer to the world, right? So definitely, definitely there's an opportunity to learn how people are generous and how they give in other parts. Of the world. Given circles are not new and they're not American or they're not Western. Like the whole, you know, concept of people banding together to create change and to take care of one another is as old as you know humanity itself. So in you see um this type of community philanthropy everywhere in the world. And actually, you know, this this year, and I'm very excited that next year is going to be even more, we are starting to do a lot more global work. So um uh I just got a call a couple of weeks ago from some partners in Mexico that are going to do a pop-up giving circle during Giving Tuesday, right? So, you know, united these two parts, also talking to someone in Colombia about the same thing. Um, a few months ago, I had some conversations in Singapore with some folks there, and they just started giving circles to support uh families. So it's families, so six families go and support another family. So, as you said, it's kind of these mutual aid societies blur lines of how do we take care of one another. Um, in Africa, we see many, many uh examples of this. Actually, um, I went to the Global Summit for Giving Tuesday, and uh the the country leader from I believe it was Senegal, he said, you know, for us with the concept of Giving Tuesday at the beginning was hard to grasp because people were like, How do you what do you mean about one day for giving or one day of generosity? We're always generous, we always give. So the way they do it is the day to celebrate generosity. And imagine when we get to that point, right? Like people are always generous, people are always giving, and we just pick a day to celebrate, but it's not a day to to give. And something that I see in other parts of the world is that, you know, here in the US, we have this whole thing with the tax, you know, advantages of giving. In many countries, people don't have that, and they still give. So I think it's it's again, it's going back to thinking the issues and the problems of this world as are so huge, so big, that all of us need to be involved. It cannot be, you know, just a handful of billionaires saying, okay, I'm going to support this causes. We all have to get involved. And you know, many times they ask me, okay, are you saying that uh billionaires shouldn't be given and it's just, you know, giving circles and everyday people? No, by no means. We need everyone, everyone's to be a phil everyone to be a philanthropist.

SPEAKER_00 24:57

Yeah, and it's it's really interesting you mentioned that that question of um sort of elite philanthropy and billionaire philanthropy, because obviously that tends to suck up a lot of the oxygen in in terms of discussions around philanthropy. Yeah. And and I agree, I think you know, we need all of it, you know, these are these are big problems, and we we all need to play our part. But do you see that there's there's a role for models of collective giving and giving circles in in potentially sort of providing, if not an antidote, a kind of a different approach that can show how maybe we can um answer some of the the concerns about the fact that if you allow big money philanthropy to dictate where resources go, it becomes quite undemocratic or sort of anti-democratic. Whereas actually, if we you know spread decision making much more broadly across all of us, suddenly we can kind of be much more positive about the power of philanthropy in society. Do you think is that part of the narrative as as you talk to people about collective giving?

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Actually, yes, because um, I mean, you you you may know these statistics, but it's it's it is ridiculous where all the money goes and all the costs um, you know, with women and girls, like my God, that that percentage doesn't change, right? It's 2% of philanthropic dollars go to women and girls. And if you think about you know, women's uh women and girls of color is uh abysmal, right? Or if you think about you know uh funding going to the LGBTQ community is like 0.3%, or you know, Native Americans is 0.6%. So really uh an indigenous community is actually at the global level is 0.6%. It is infuriating. All of us should get infuriated. And I feel that what the power that we have as everyday people, as everyday donors, is collective giving, right? Because there are many things that we don't have control, but where we donate our money, where we you know focus our efforts, we can control that. And we can change not only how we give, because as you said, it's like you know, if we start putting the power of the decision making in the communities, we but we are also changing what gets funded, right? And I feel that because you know, very um wealthy folks have approached us and say, is there is there a way that we can partner with giving circles? And I feel that yes, and the and and the the big benefit that the giving circles can give to you know an ultra-high level uh wealth individual is that ultra local focus, right? Because a lot of the small grassroots organizations that get funded by giving circles are totally invisible to big philanthropy. So this family foundation or this, you know, big foundation is never going to find up. And by partnering with a local giving circle, they can support those small organizations. For a lot of giving circles, um, you know, giving circles tend to serve as seed funders for very small organizations. Uh, organizations that here in the US, you know, talk in California, right? Because sometimes I say these uh amounts of money and they sound huge, but here in California they are not, you know, with budgets of less than a million dollars, less than half a million dollars. They're tiny, tiny, tiny organizations that are never going to get, you know, a grant from a big foundation because the foundation is not going to find them. So, how giving circles come in acid funders and also kind of giving this, I don't know, kind of like giving that trust to this organization that then, you know, that organization can leverage to get other uh funding revenues, right? Going to corporations, going to other foundations and saying we have been supported by, you know, uh the East Bay Latina Given Circle for the past couple of years, right? So I think there's many benefits also from the nonprofit side by partnering with Given Circles.

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Yeah, absolutely. I was going to ask um about it, and you touched on it there, that as well as just uh increasing the visibility and allowing larger funders, whether that's foundations or corporates, to see some of those grassroots organizations, is is it also partly that even if they knew who those organizations were, they might think that the risk profile was was too high for them to fund. But that's just because they're so far removed from those groups. Whereas a giving circle because they they know the people and they're you know it's not high risk for them to fund it, but then it also sort of confers. I'm not sure legitimacy is the right word, but it kind of, you know, once you've received one gift from from an organization that looks legitimate and trustworthy, suddenly everybody else thinks it's okay to fund you.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

So yes, I love what you said, uh Rodri, um, of you know they know the people, right? Because that is it, it's all about relationships. And I feel that that is also something that giving circles, because a lot of times it's the same people from the community. Is that right? Is it is that uh proximity and that, you know, uh going and volunteering and knowing the people, knowing the people that the nonprofit uh is serving, knowing the other volunteers, the leadership, and especially because you know, giving circle members get so engaged with the causes that they support that also are the perfect pipeline for being, you know, uh on the board of these organizations at some point, right? So it's also a civic engagement mini laboratory, if you want to see it like that. People that are, and that is coming also in the on the in the research. There is a relationship between being part of a given circle and being civically engaged.

SPEAKER_00 31:04

Yeah, no, I'm I'm absolutely um sure. I think that that whole idea of you know giving or philanthropy as a sort of nursery of democracy, the kind of tockvillian idea. I mean, it does work. When it works, it really works. So I'm one of the things I wanted to ask actually was we were talking there about you know giving circles, potentially getting money to um places that they otherwise wouldn't get to. Does that also extend to different types of organizations or that are kind of kind of working towards different goals? But and and by that I mean, you know, one of the concerns, I guess, at the moment around the relationship between philanthropy and more sort of justice-focused social movements, is that in some people's eyes, uh, philanthropy and and particularly kind of institutional philanthropy kind of reflects the status quo and and kind of people who have succeeded within that status quo. So it's never genuinely going to want that status quo to be changed fundamentally. Whereas, you know, our are giving circles, because they represent more you know everyday ordinary people, are they more likely to fund things that you know genuinely are seeking to kind of change this the status quo in fairly radical ways? Have you seen any examples of that?

SPEAKER_01 32:20

Yes, totally, totally. And that is extremely exciting. Actually, you know, we we uh have an initiative called the Social Justice Giving Circle Project that now it's sitting at justice funders, but that was the whole idea. Giving circles, they not only support, you know, established 501c3 nonprofit organizations, right? Giving circles support uh different initiatives, support, you know, movement leaders, support individuals, right? So, and especially with all what has been happening in the world in the last few years, more and more we're seeing giving circles that are uh going away from the traditional path of supporting an established nonprofit. And I feel that that is something that we also see with younger people. Like, you know, I am uh I am the mother of three adult children, right? They are 20, 21, and 24, and they are extremely generous, but they're they rarely give to established nonprofit, right? So, and I feel that that is something that yes, we're seeing more and more. And uh they're giving struggles that are being established uh specifically to support uh social uh social justice leaders.

SPEAKER_00 33:37

Yeah, it's really that's really interesting. I think it is that sense that younger people definitely are giving, but perhaps in ways that you know we're failing to capture. So we're we're not understanding what giving and generosity looks like, I think is is really important. Um and I the other thing it made me think of, which which comes back to something you mentioned in passing earlier, when you talked about the um uh the potential uh project in Mexico and then looking at the kind of pop-up model of giving circles, was how many of the giving circles that you're seeing being formed are kind of formed as ongoing organizations, and how many of them are shorter or time-limited or a bit more ephemeral? Do you do you see a mix of those two things? Because it feels as though, particularly younger people, again, they're less interested in kind of ongoing relationships with non-profits or kind of you know sticking to established brand relationships. They're more interested in kind of things that are immediate and short term and responding to need. And I wondered whether that was being reflected in in the giving circles that are being formed as well.

SPEAKER_01 34:38

Uh, there is definitely a mix. Um, so you have you know some giving circles that are very established, that they meet, you know, um every year, that they give, you know, one grant, one run of grants annually or two, um, and they meet every quarter. So they're definitely the established giving circles. Uh, there's also, you know, a lot of one time off uh kind of like event type giving circle. Actually, um in the UK is uh the funding network, and uh and they have giving circles in many different places uh in the world, and it's kind of like event-based. So you come, you, and that day you give. And you know, some people may come to the next event in a few months, and some people may not come, right? And these types of giving circles are great to give taste of how you know how a giving circle works. Uh it's the same as you know, a uh like a pop-up giving circle. Actually, a pop-up giving circle is you go through all the stages of a giving circle in 90 minutes, right? It's great to bring in new people. And the whole idea of that is that from there people will get kind of hooked and then they will decide to do one long term. But you know, it's I feel that everything depends on the culture of each circle. I am part of a given circle here in San Francisco, that it's inside of a social club. And I love it because there's so much potential there to do this. This is the only social club in the world that has a philanthropic arm. And so I'm like, I'm imagining, right? Like how many social clubs are in New York or in London? Like we could, we should have given circles in all of them. But the way uh battery powered, it's called battery powered, which is really cool, um, works, is there are three themes picked every year. So even though it's an established giving circle, there are different themes completely every time. So people are learning from different causes, different organizations. So it's really dynamic. And uh there are about you know 550 members, and they're about $3 million moved every year. So it's a it's a pretty, you know, powerful giving circle. At the same time, you know, I'm also a member of uh the Latina Peninsula Giving Circle. We're a small circle, we're 25 women, uh, most of us uh Latinas, and we give to Latino-led nonprofit organizations in our county, right? So it's very specific. Every year, uh we our first you know, meeting of the year, we sit down and we review what worked, what didn't work uh the previous year, and we review also our funding priorities. And we decide if we're going to keep them or you know, move to another cause. Okay, we have been together for almost 10 years. We all we have not moved funding priorities. Why? Because yes, I mean we we uh we have become very close to the organizations on the ground that you know work in the in the costs that we care about, right? So it's we have become become kind of like a like a family with the organization. So uh it's it's more now like, okay, let's review the funding priorities, but we know that we're going to give them. So I think it depends on the culture of the circle.

SPEAKER_00 38:09

Yeah, absolutely. And and one thing I wanted to ask actually, because you talked there about um uh the fact that the the focus of that giving circle was within the county. So again, it has kind of a pr a pretty tight geographic um range. Um and you said you know the the majority of giving circles that you're seeing were geographic in in nature or kind of locally focused. Um have you you seen any where they are identity-based to some extent? And some some of that giving might also be focused locally, but there's also a kind of diaspora element as well, where they're doing some or or you know, or potentially all of their giving based on a kind of shared identity, but but with people who are elsewhere in the country or potentially even outside of the country.

SPEAKER_01 38:52

Yes, totally, totally. There are many, um, and you know, I think you can find giving circles with every single ethnicity or you know, type of faith possible, right? They are um API giving circles uh given to local API communities. Um you have you know Muslim American giving circles giving abroad or giving here, uh, Jewish giving circles giving here in the US or giving to organizations in Israel. Um you have Native American giving circles. So it's everything, everything, everything that you can imagine exists. Uh as I was saying, also, you know, uh maybe identity based giving to another identity base or these types of solidarity grants, right? Um there was this instance a few years ago uh when the uh murder of George Floyd happened, that the Los Angeles Latino Giving Circle uh got together with the Black Lab Giving Circle in LA to support Black organizations, right? Because it was needed at that moment. And then, you know, a few months later, there were uh there was this need to support street vendors in Los Angeles, that they're you know, mainly Latinos, and the Black Giving Circle came to support that with the Latino Giving Circle. So there's a lot of you know interaction, and that is, I feel, what uh what gives me hope that by having an organization like Philanthropy together where we we support with you know free um trainings and resources and videos and everything under the sun to every person that is you know involved in a given circle, no matter no matter where in the world, that people can connect and find one another uh and not having to reinvent the will.

SPEAKER_00 40:50

Yeah, absolutely. Um I'm aware I'm in danger of taking up far too much of your time. So I just have a a couple more questions. Um one of them I think that I wanted to ask, because it's you know, we've talked quite a lot about um, you know, identity, which is obviously an important element of bringing people together to form uh giving circles or other collective giving models. But is there also a possibility that in places or or you know wherever for some reason identity is no longer felt strongly, maybe you know that is a place or within a particular group, you can use collective giving to bring people together and try and forge a sense of identity. So it kind of goes the other way around. Have you have you ever seen that happen where kind of those ties of identity are relatively weak? And then through engagement and collective giving, people form a much stronger sense of community and identity.

SPEAKER_01 41:40

Totally, totally. For example, you know, the the the group at Battery Powered, right? It's a social club, but people come from you know many different identities, many different backgrounds, and they are part of the giving circle. And what brings them together is that, you know, desire of you know, do something for the San Francisco community, right? Also, you know, a lot of the women's giving circles, even though, yes, you know, it's identity because it's women, you have women from you know many different backgrounds and and and ideas. Uh, and and and some, you know, in some of the identity-based given circles, you see people that are allies, right? That they may not be, they may not share the same identity, but they want to be part of it to support that community. So uh we yeah, we see many cases like that. There's also, you know, a big network, uh, because that I forgot to mention. They they exist many networks of given circles. And um, one of these networks is called the States Project, and it's uh a network of political given circles. So there you have people that also, you know, many different identities and ethnicities come together towards a different goal, right?

SPEAKER_00 42:58

Yeah, it'd really, really fascinating. Um I'm I'm gonna let you go at this point, but I just wanted to give you uh a chance. Well, first of all, to say thank you ever so much for finding time to come on the podcast. It's really great to talk and really sort of fascinating to hear about the work you're doing. Um, but just a chance, you know, if you've got particular things coming up that you wanted to make people aware about um in terms of what's coming up next for plans for philanthropy together, or all your thoughts on kind of what you would like to see more broadly happen in in philanthropy um, you know, over the coming year.

SPEAKER_01 43:27

Well, I just want to invite everyone to you know engage with us. Every single resource that we have on our website is free of charge. Uh, we have a great website called what is the givencircle.com, and we have it in four different languages. Uh, it's in English, Spanish, Mandarin, German. Um, it's coming up in the next few weeks in Portuguese. Uh, a lot of our you know, materials are also in different languages. So just inviting everybody to join us. We have trainings every month around you know how. You start your own giving circle. We have a big directory of global giving circles to find one that is near you. And if you don't find one, you can start your own. With these trainings that we have, we have trainings for individuals, we have trainings for organizations. So community foundations, faith-based uh organizations, et cetera, et cetera. We have a training specifically for nonprofits that want to use the model of a given circle within their ecosystem. And also, you know, and very exciting is this year we have started working with collaboratives and collaborative funds to try to foster the growth of this very nascent field. So again, you know, we have a bunch of articles and resources on our website. And I would invite everybody to come and take a look. Our website is philanthropy together.org. And um and I'm you know happy to answer any questions and to email everybody that email us.

SPEAKER_00 45:01

And uh yeah, I will put links uh in the show notes for this episode to places where people can find all of that information um easily. Um and I you know thoroughly recommend that people go and check it out. Um it just remains to say thanks ever so much, Sarah. It's been a real pleasure talking, um, and you know, wish you all the best with with your work uh with Philanthropy Together.

SPEAKER_01 45:19

Thank you so much, Rodery. Thank you so much for inviting me.

SPEAKER_00 45:31

Okay, great. Well, my thanks again to Sarah for coming on uh the podcast. Uh it was great to have a chance to talk to her and hear about the work that she's doing uh with philanthropy together. Um I will put links in the show notes to places where you can find much more detail on what philanthropy together does, and if you're inspired to go out there and form uh your own Giving Circle or find out if there's a pre-existing Giving Circle near you that you can join, you'll be able to do that. Um if you're interested more broadly in issues around philanthropy and the civil society, do check out my website at uh whyphilanthropymatters.com where you can get lots of articles and bits of news all about philanthropy and civil society. You can get all the back episodes of this uh podcast and you can sign up for our monthly newsletter which uh brings you all the kind of latest news and insights on what's going on in the world of philanthropy around the globe. Uh if you've got ideas for people that you think would be a good way to talk to on the podcast or topics that we can take a deep dive into, um do drop me a line. You can find my contact details on the website. Uh if you're interested in uh slightly pithier, kind of more digestible content, do follow me on social media. I'm spending an increasing amount of time on LinkedIn, as a lot of people are. I'm still just about on the uh you know the dying embers of Twitter, and I'm also experimenting on Threads and Blue Sky and various other places, so please do uh come and find me in any of those places. Um other than that, just like, subscribe, tell anyone that you think might be interested in the podcast about it, leave us a nice review on iTunes or wherever else you get your podcasts, and I will see you next time. Bye-bye.